\\NEWSERVER\FirstLD\Video_A_L\B\Banks_Ernie\Banks_Ernie_02.mpgF:\The HistoryMakers from sctnserver\Oserver_MAC\HMWebSite_Dev\Individual HistoryMakers\B\Banks, Ernie\Transcript\Banks_Ernie_02.txtTyler BarnettErnie Banks begins by describing his family background, including the harmonious marriage shared by his parents. He details the personality of his mother, who had a positive influence on Banks when he was young. Banks shares some stories from his childhood involving his family and friends, including being jilted on his prom night. He explains how he acquired his work ethic from his father. Banks details his personality as a child, describing himself as an introvert, especially during elementary school. He talks about his parents' occupations, and relates a story of his own employment as a teenager. Banks describes his athletic exploits as a high school student, saying that he had only average athletic ability and his favorite sport was softball. He explains how his father encouraged him to play baseball from an early age. Banks closes by outlining his stint in the Army, and briefly explains that he entered Major League Baseball shortly after his discharge.A2000.0032000The HistoryMakers2000-07-18Banks, Ernie, 1931-Julieanna RichardsonChicago, Illinois00:29:31.519994Banks_Ernie_02The HistoryMakers02:00:06:21Ernie Banks interview, tape 2Matthew HickeyErnie Banks describes his father's family backgroundNow, I want to go to your father’s [Eddie Banks] side of the family. Did you have grandparents that were alive or great-grandparents that you knew?I didn’t know them. I’d love to have met them. My mother [Essie Banks] talk about it now. But she only reminds me my grandfather was a minister, and he wanted me to be a minister. But I never met him. I didn’t meet her father. I never met her mother. And that is one kind of dark side in my life. I would love to have met my grandparents.You’re saying neither set of grandparents did you meet?No.That’s the same with me.And I miss that.Well, no. I met on my mother’s side, but--Yeah, I missed that, so.Where was your father from originally?From Marshall, Texas.And how far is that from Dallas [Texas]?That’s about 125 miles. My mother was from Shreveport [Louisiana], which is nearby, about sixty miles away. So, I’ve been to Marshall many times, but I never connected with anybody that even knew him there. I’ve been to Shreveport, and I never met anybody that was connected to my mother. But I’d love to have been associated with them, and had a chance to meet them and went to a family reunion or something, but it never happened.Autobiographical::Family::Parents::FatherAutobiographical::Family::Parents::MotherAutobiographical::Family::Ancestors::GrandfatherBanks, Ernie, 1931-Ernie Banks talks about his parents' marriageOkay. Your father [Eddie Banks], how did he meet your mother [Essie Banks]? You said that there was this--it’s like a fifteen-year age difference?Yeah. The way I understand it she was sixteen years-old. He was thirty-five. And they met in Dallas [Texas], and they got married. And that was all I knew about their relationship. And he worked, and she worked, and they were, you know, great parents. They were very honest with themselves and honest with me and my sister. My mother kept a clean house. She cooked all the time and my dad worked, the typical things that I thought in a family. The dad worked. My mother stayed at home and she worked occasionally doing housework, and she still brags about being the best person in the world to clean a house. And she taught my sister how to clean a house. And they were just, you know, a nice couple that, you know, with different ages that got along real well.Banks, Ernie, 1931-Families::MarriagesAutobiographical::Family::Parents::FatherAutobiographical::Family::Parents::MotherErnie Banks describes his mother's personalityAnd now, describe your mother [Essie Banks]. I know she’s still alive, but describe her.She--.And what’s her name?Her name is Essie Banks, very, very smart lady--got a wonderful sense of humor. She meets people well. My dad [Eddie Banks] was just the opposite. He didn’t meet people well. He didn’t like people that much. She was the opposite of that. She really liked being around people, talking and sharing some of her memories and laughing. And she enjoyed her children, and she enjoyed working, and she really enjoyed life to the fullest, although she was much younger than my dad, as I said earlier. But she was quite different, quite jovial. She liked family things. She’d always have everybody together for Sunday meals and go to church. She was very involved with the church. She took us to church. Almost every Sunday, we had to go and dress up and all that. So she’s kind of the master of the family. She reads the Bible a lot, as much as she can read, and she talks about the Bible. And every time I talk to her, she would mention some scripture from the Bible that stands in my mind for the whole day. And then when I left, I used to call her up, "okay, give me the thing that I should live by today." And she always say many different thing, but the one thing I thought about a lot is that--I don’t remember the proverb, that "life and death is in the power of the tongue." "Life and death is in the power of the tongue." So when I hear her say that, I didn’t talk very much. I mean I just kind of got to quiet--I really didn’t like to talk. I liked listening better than talking, and because I used to hear people talk, and most of the thing that came out of their mouth were real negative things that affected their own lives. And I used to think about that, said, "gosh, I mean boy, if people could ever, you know, look at their lives and think about how wonderful they are to even be here." Example, like people look in the mirror and say, "gosh, I’m fat. I’m too skinny. I’m too this. I’m too that." When I got over into sports, I used to hear that a lot. You know, negative things about their own life. Nothing positive about their own life. So the words that I learned from just what she would tell me--they’re from the Bible--that I would live by those things and follow those things on a daily basis. But I like listening. That’s what I really like.Autobiographical::Childhood and YouthAutobiographical::Family::Parents::MotherAutobiographical::Personal philosophyAutobiographical::ValuesAutobiographical::ReligionBanks, Ernie, 1931-Ernie Banks shares some stories about growing up in DallasNow, what is one of your earliest childhood memories?(Pause). Don’t really have any early childhood memories, some people I’ve been around that have been fascinating to me. I grew up with a young man named Rex Ellis that couldn’t hear. He was deaf. He didn’t have an earphone at that time--I mean an earpiece. But to be around him and see how he communicated with me, you know, by lip reading and whatever way he did it, I mean that was pretty unusual to me. And we were real good friends. We did a lot of things together. He played sports in school and all of that. But just growing up with a young man that was a close friend that couldn’t hear, I mean he was handicapped but I didn’t, and he didn’t, we didn’t press it on each other.And any other memories you have of growing up around your family or friends or school?Just my mother [Essie Banks]. One holiday, she had me wring a chicken’s neck and that’s what we had for dinner. And that was pretty unusual for me. And then, somebody stole the chicken after I wrung his neck. And then, I put him down and going down to get some hot water so I could put him in the hot water and pick his feathers. When I came back, the chicken was stolen. And my mother traced the blood all the way down to the neighbor’s place, and we found the chicken, and the neighbor gave it back to us. But that was a pretty unusual experience for me at that time.Was Dallas [Texas] rural then? Was it more like a big small town back then?Yeah. It was a big city, but we just lived near the market. I don’t know why. We lived on Katy Street. That’s where the market, the produce--and came in from all parts of Texas. And that was pretty interesting to me because we’d go over there and buy different things, corn, watermelon, cucumbers, okra, and I enjoyed that, you know, just seeing people come from all parts of Texas on certain days to the market to buy things. And it was pretty interesting to see that, you know.00/00/1935-00/00/1945Banks, Ernie, 1931-Locations::US::Texas::DallasAutobiographical::Childhood and YouthAutobiographical::Family::Parents::MotherErnie Banks talks about his busy childhood householdHow many years are between you and your sister and you and your--Two. Two years all the way down.All the way down. Okay. So the family was very bustling, you always having a newcomer?That’s right.So how was that?That was very exciting. My sister did most of the things with the newborn, and I would, you know, help change diapers and all that kind of stuff. So, we kind of shared the responsibility with my mother [Essie Banks], and when she was pregnant, carrying the children around. We would always, you know, make sure she, you know, took the right steps and got her exercise and, you know, tried to eat right. It was an experience, a good experience.00/00/1935-00/00/1950Autobiographical::Family::SiblingsAutobiographical::Family::SisterAutobiographical::Family::Parents::MotherFamilies::Family sizeBanks, Ernie, 1931-Ernie Banks explains why he likes his nameAny special responsibilities? Was it you, you know, because you were the oldest son? You weren’t a "junior," though.No.Now, why is that?I don’t know. I have a brother that was--he was a "junior," the one next to me. His name was Eddie Banks, Junior. I don’t know. My dad’s name is Ernest Banks, and I liked the name because it’s tied into money on both ends. When you buy a house, you’ve got to put down earnest money. I guess that’s why. And then, my last name, Banks. And then, as I traveled through my baseball career, that’s what I wanted to do, have my own bank, the Ernie Banks Banks on the Left Banks. They wrote it in the papers. And I worked at a bank, but that’s what I really wanted to be, a banker.Autobiographical::NameAutobiographical::Family::Parents::FatherAutobiographical::Family::BrotherAutobiographical::Work and Career::Career aspirationsBanks, Ernie, 1931-Ernie Banks talks about his work ethicI was just asking if you had any special role as the oldest boy.Special role?(simultaneously) Right.No, just work. I understood work, and I picked cotton with my dad [Eddie Banks]. He took me, you know, in the fall to pick cotton, and I enjoyed that. He took me on his job to work, and I did that. Whatever--my life as growing up was kind of like, you know, whatever came up, I could adjust to it. I still do that now again in my life, whatever it is. Like Liz [Banks], my wife, will come up and say, "we’re going to Japan." And I just adjust to things. And once I get into them, I find in my mind that "what can I learn from this kind of experience?" It’s not that old saying, you know, "I’ve been there, done that." It’s just the experience is always there. So, I mean, what can I learn from this experience, and is there anybody that I can help with this experience? I know they can help me, but how can I help them? So I just kind of get into things.Autobiographical::PersonalityAutobiographical::ValuesAutobiographical::Childhood and YouthAutobiographical::Family::Parents::FatherBanks, Ernie, 1931-Ernie Banks shares a story about being jilted at his promAnd I went to prom, and my mom [Essie Banks] made me go to the prom, and the girl didn’t want to go. I didn’t know any girls, so she got a girl for me. And I went to the prom. Bought me a jacket for fifty cents at Salvation Army, and I didn’t want to go. She said, "well, you’ve got to go." So I went, and the girl left and went with somebody else. So it was all right. She said, "where did"--I forget her name--"what happened to Susie? Did you all have a good time?" I said, "yeah, we had a great time. she went home with James Harrison." "What? She wouldn’t?" I said, "Yeah." So, she says, "that’s not nice." Well, it happens. That’s the way it is. That’s the way life is.Okay. Can I go back a little earlier than the prom?Yeah.(Laughs). You know, women are usually jilted on their prom night, not men.Women are what now?Women are usually jilted on their prom night, not men.Well, can I tell you why? I mean--Don’t tell us your universe story 'cause I'm in the room and I don't want to laugh.I mean I could tell you why. I mean I was a skinny kid. I had a big old jacket on, and, you know, I mean--. And the other guy, James Harrison, was the quarterback, and he was very popular and all those kind of things. And, you know, I don’t regret anything. It just happened that way. I wasn’t, you know, one of these type of kids that always tried to look well and, you know, chase after the girls and all that. I didn’t understand any of that. My friends use to take girls different places. A guy named Finey Sorba: "come on, man, we’ve got to go to this party." "What party?" And he’d take me over there and, you know, I just didn’t--I was very naïve about many things for a long time.00/00/1947-00/00/1949Autobiographical::Childhood and YouthAutobiographical::Educational experience::High schoolAutobiographical::Parties and celebrationsAutobiographical::PersonalityBanks, Ernie, 1931-Ernie Banks describes his personality as a young personI didn’t have any concern for what other people, you know--naturally with all of us--"come on. Let’s go here. Come on. Try this. Come on. Go." And at [age] seventeen, I went to Amarillo, Texas to play baseball. And I was playing softball on the church team, and the guys came up and say, "hey, you think you want to play baseball?" I said, "I don’t know. Go down to ask my mom and dad." And they did. So, they took me to Amarillo, Texas. I never experienced anything going away. And I went out there and just adjusted to that, stayed in hotels where the rain was leaking and all that. And I came back. Mom [Essie Banks]--, "how was it?" "It was fine." I didn’t complain about things. I don’t feel that--most things are not perfect, and there’s always challenges in our life until I got to the majors [Major League Baseballl]. Then, I began to see life in the pink.Okay, I’m going to stop you. I want to go back. What was the young Ernie Banks like? I mean what did you dream of being? Did you have any dreams when you were young? And I’m talking about maybe even before teenage years. Was there anything that you sort of daydreamed about or thought about, or wished you were, or?I was more an introvert, I didn't--. Sit in the back of the class and just listen to people. I just liked listening to people. And I didn’t play sports. Bill Blair got me on the football team, got me on the softball team, got me up to the YMCA [Young Men's Christian Association] to play all sports. I had no real interest in many things that most of the young people were doing. I was not a boring person. I just didn’t understand any of that. I read a lot. I stayed in the crowd, but I didn’t say very much when I was with the guys, and they had the girlfriends. Everybody would do all the talking. I’d just sit there and listen to them. And but sports came later in my life, and it was occurred by somebody else. I had no interest. I didn’t understand how you could put on a baseball team or a softball team twenty-five people together, and they do something worthwhile, ‘cause most of them I thought was, you know, didn’t like each other and had different frictions and all kinds of stuff. But I got into it and began to see that, how it all developed. But I didn’t dream a lot; I just thought a lot. I was a thinker. I loved thinking. I don’t see much of it now. I don’t think we really use our minds as much as we should. We’re not challenged enough on our mental capacities in our life. We just kind of fluff it off, but I like thinking.00/00/1948Autobiographical::Childhood and YouthAutobiographical::PersonalityAutobiographical::Personal philosophyAutobiographical::Educational experience::High schoolBanks, Ernie, 1931-Sports::Baseball::AmateurAutobiographical::Avocations and RecreationsAutobiographical::ValuesErnie Banks describes his parents' occupationsYour mother [Essie Banks], she was a housewife. She stayed home.And she, you know, worked. She cleaned houses for whites, and then she stayed at home.Just think about that. She has all those kids, and she’s still cleaning houses. And your father [Eddie Banks]?He was a porter, you know. He did odd jobs and, you know, worked for Wyatt’s for twenty years, a supermarket chain, loading trucks, washing cars or shining shoes, whatever. He adjusted to things real well in his life, and that was it. And he’d come home, give the money to my mother, take about two or three dollars. Go down and get him a half a pint. He wasn’t an alcoholic, now. He’d get him a half a pint, and he enjoyed. Sit down and play some dominos with some brothers and a little checkers, and that was enjoyment. He’d go right back to work the following week. And that’s kind of what I saw in my life as a young person is that you just do what you have to do. It’s okay. The opportunities will come if you want to go over here or stay where you are. And he was like that. I just learned that from his life. He was ambitious, but he was happy in his own life. I think sometime we--never satisfied. We all want to go to more. "I got this. Now, I want more of this. I want more of that. I want more of this." But I just learned that, you know, be satisfied where you are, what you’re doing. That’s it. And she was the same way. She wanted more things, a little bit more. She wanted the houses and cars and all the material stuff. But he did not, and she used to get on him about that: "Eddie, why don’t you start thinking about buying a house? Why aren’t you thinking about buying a car?" He just smiled when he said he just didn’t have any interest in that.00/00/1931-00/00/1950Autobiographical::Family::Parents::FatherAutobiographical::Family::Parents::MotherAutobiographical::Childhood and YouthAutobiographical::Personal philosophyAutobiographical::ValuesLocations::US::Texas::DallasFamilies::Parents::African American parentsBanks, Ernie, 1931-Ernie Banks talks about growing up in a segregated Dallas, TexasNow, you lived in the part of Dallas [Texas]--was there a black part of town? Were you in the black part of town? Was Dallas pretty segregated back then?Yeah.Did you go to an all-black school?All-black school, and I lived near the school. And it was Safeway [grocery store] right there on the corner there, and my mom [Essie Banks] used to go down there and get pig feet, pig tails, ox tails, all that stuff out of the trash can, come back and cook it. We’ll eat it and carry on. And during the war [World War II], I mean that’s what’s--many things, she would just find things to do and to make it and was happy with that. I learned from that, well, not happy, but being contented with where you are, I mean that you’re surviving and you feed your kids, and, you know, we can pay our rent and, you know, food, clothing, shelter, the basic things of life. But I always would go down to that store and, you know, help work around the store. I had a job working at a hotel, mopping the floors and all that. I didn’t like it. I quit, and I told the--I just walked off the job and came home. Mom said, "what, did you quit the job?" "Yeah." "Well, you want to get paid?" I said, "No, I don’t want to get paid. They can keep their money." I just didn’t like the way, you know, the attitude of the people and how they were, you know, expressing things to me and other people that was working in the hotel.And how old were you then?I was about sixteen.Okay. What ways were they expressing?Well, "get over here. Do this. Get over here. Do that. Don’t do this, here. Why are you doing this, here?" And it always kind of got close to me when people, you know, kind of order others around without any reason, I mean like they’re mad about you being there. So, I just left. I didn’t want to be paid. I said, "I don’t even want to go back to get my paycheck. Let them have it." I wasn’t angry about it. I didn’t tell her why. I just said, "I just don’t care for that type of job. I want to find something else." Then, I got a job as a bellman at the hotel over there in Dallas.00/00/1939-00/00/194500/00/1947Autobiographical::Childhood and YouthAfrican Americans - Socialization::"Double conciousness"African Americans - Socialization::Learning race relationsAutobiographical::Work and careerAutobiographical::Work and career::Work environmentSegregationPovertySocioeconomic statusBanks, Ernie, 1931-Race relationsErnie Banks talks about his school daysWhere did you go to elementary school and junior high and high school? Where did you go?I went to JW Ray [Elementary School], and Booker T. Washington High School. And I don’t remember much about the elementary school, just that I walked to school, came back and, you know, didn’t have a lot of friends there. But, you know, I talked to the kid--listen to the kids, walked around and listened to them talk. So, most of them thought I was deaf and dumb 'cause I didn’t say very much. I did my assignments. The teacher wouldn’t ask me many questions. You know, all the smart kids would raise their hand first. And, you know, I just went along, did my assignment, turn it in, come to school on time. I always liked being on time for school, the last one to leave. I just liked to stand around looking. And I’d walk home and Mom [Essie Banks], "where you been?" I said, "I’ve been just standing around school." "Okay." I didn’t, you know, like a lot of kids that play the basketball and all that. I just came home.You had elementary and then junior high and high school, or was it elementary to high school?Elementary, high school.I heard someone else say that recently. So, you started high school in seventh grade? Is that what--Elementary school?No, high school. Eighth, or what year did you start?What is it? Ninth? Eighth? Ninth. Nine, yeah.So, you were in elementary the whole time up until ninth grade.That’s what I recall, yeah.Autobiographical::Educational experience::Elementary schoolAutobiographical::Educational experience::High schoolAutobiographical::PersonalityChildren and Youth::African American children - Attitudes toward educationEducation::Schools::Elementary schools::J.W. Ray Elementary School (Dallas, TX)Education::Schools::High schools::Booker T. Washington High School (Dallas, TX)Locations::US::Texas::DallasBanks, Ernie, 1931-Ernie Banks talks about his average athletic talent in high schoolSo, were you playing ball on the streets and everything before? When did you start playing-?--I mean I read that in high school, you were, like, all-around athlete, really.No.No?I lived in high school. I went up to watch the football team practice, and Bill Blair got me to play. "Hey, you should be playing on this team." He called the coach over, and I went and got a uniform. I was just kind of nurtured in going in and running track. We had no basketball team. We had no baseball team at the high school I went to. And my mom only saw me play one football game, and I got hurt on that game. I broke my collarbone. And it was the last game. But I was encouraged to play sports, just like it is now in my own life. I mean somebody come along and say, "you’ve got to do this." "Okay. I’ll do it," and that’s what I did. I went out and started playing football and played basketball at the YMCA [Young Men's Christian Association] and then ran track, and that was about it--played softball, and that was about it. But I was not an All-American and all that kind of stuff.Well, I didn’t mean All-American, but you had facility in all of them, right? You were pretty good at all of them.No.You weren’t?I was not.Somewhere, I read--I was not. I played end on the football team. And the other kid that played end is named Joe Kirben, and I see him a lot. We talk a lot. He’s done well in Dallas [Texas]. And he was, like, faster and, you know, better. And they threw all the passes to him. Once in a while, they’d throw the pass to me, but I was not an outstanding football player, you know, in terms of scholarships and all that kind of stuff. In basketball, just average. And ran track, I did the broad jump at track and the high jump and was just average type of athlete. And there were other players on the team that were much better, you know, and went on to scholarship to college and all that.00/00/1945-00/00/1949Ability::Athletic abilityAutobiographical::Avocations and RecreationsAutobiographical::Childhood and YouthAutobiographical::Educational experience::High schoolLocations::US::Texas::DallasBanks, Ernie, 1931-Sports::Baseball::AmateurSports::Football::High SchoolErnie Banks talks about enjoying softball more than baseball as a young personAnd so you finished high school what year?1950.1950, okay. And at that point, which of the sports were you enjoying the most? You talked about this whole thing of you were playing softball.Softball.And, you know--I enjoyed softball.Now, why did you enjoy softball more than baseball?Well, you could hit the ball. You didn’t strike out a lot. You hit the ball. Everybody hit the ball. It was fast, you know, a fast game. And, you know, everybody had fun. It seemed like it was more fun with everybody playing it. It was not so much focused on winning and somebody being a star over the other. And I liked that small camaraderie. It was a church team owned by a guy named J.W. Whirl. And he was always there, and he’d kind of nurture us along and talk to us over and over again. But I really enjoyed playing softball. It was a twelve-inch [ball]. There’s a sixteen, is the bigger, and a twelve-inch they played in Texas at the time that I came along.00/00/1946-00/00/1950Ability::Athletic abilityAutobiographical::Childhood and YouthAutobiographical::Avocations and RecreationsAutobiographical::Educational experience::High schoolAutobiographical::PersonalityLocations::US::Texas::DallasBanks, Ernie, 1931-Sports::SoftballErnie Banks describes how his father encouraged him to play baseballAnd why do you think your father [Eddie Banks] encouraged you to do baseball? I mean did he know the fine distinctions between softball and baseball?He did. I don’t know. I’ve thought about it a little bit. Why did he--chose me to be the batboy for the team he played for, playing catch with him in the evenings and weekends? I don’t know. Maybe--I feel that some parents can see before a child is born that he or she is special. That’s the only thing I know. Before I was born, I think my father felt--this sounds corny to you, I told you I’m from another world--that I was a special child. And he nurtured me a little bit, the best he could. Many people do that today, Tiger Woods’s [golfer] dad, Venus Williams [tennis player], Michael Jordan [basketball player], a lot of athletes, men and women--Nancy Lopez [golfer]--their parents, their fathers nurtured them to be whatever they’re doing. That’s what they want them to be. When I was drafted to go in the Army, my dad felt that I shouldn’t go into the Army. He took me to a psychic, or--I still don’t remember this--a voodoo. I didn’t even ask him what. He drove me to Palestine, Texas. That’s a good name for a city. But this lady, and she sit and talked to him, said, "your son is a very special child." He said, "well, he’s going in the Army." And she said, "he’s not going in the Army. He’s going to play baseball like you want him to play baseball, and he’s going to be successful." It was night, and she had candles in the window and all that. So, we drove back.00/00/1950Sports::BaseballBanks, Ernie, 1931-Religion::VoodooismFamilies::Fathers::African American fathersAutobiographical::Childhood and YouthAutobiographical::Family::Parents::FatherAbility::Athletic abilityErnie Banks briefly describes his military experience and the start of his baseball careerI did go in the Army. I hurt my knee as soon as I went in the Army, and I spent most of the Army life in the hospital in Texas. I got out of the hospital. I went back to our unit, and then we went to Germany. My knee got--had a problem again. I went in the hospital there. And then, when I got out, they were going around asking "who played baseball in the unit?" And one of my friends, Ronald Gilmore, said, "Ernie played baseball." He’s my friend; I had been telling him that I played with the Kansas City Monarchs [baseball team] and all that. So he put my name on the list, and I was picked to play baseball. And that’s where my life began. Something I really didn’t want to do. And I came back, and I signed with the Monarchs, again. Then, the [Chicago] Cubs [baseball team] scouted me, and I came to the Cubs in ’53 [1953].00/00/1950-00/00/1953Ability::Athletic abilityAutobiographical::Military serviceAutobiographical::Work and careerAutobiographical::Work and Career::Career aspirationsAutobiographical::Work and career::Career changesAutobiographical::Work and career::Occupational choicesBanks, Ernie, 1931-Sports::BaseballSports::Baseball::ProfessionalUnited States. Army - African American troops